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JoJo said:
I hate this narrative. We can't conclusively say anything about it other than what was explicitly stated. In this very game, people mention a role madness is unpredictable - and yet others want to say they know for certain how the role works. That's incredibly suspicious behavior. If anything, it indicates to me that people are saying with confidence they knew he was a disconnected wolf and they're trying to divorce people from a useful day 1 vote.

I can't say for certain what it was and what it wasn't, but I know that no one else can other than the scum team themselves and that level of confidence and the discrediting is giving huge wolf vibes.

Seen it happen most of the day and it's something I'm going to be wary of when recombing through the thread.
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okay i know i said i was sheeping andrew's town read of you but wtf is this post? Draekke wasn't giving a conclusive narrative there? If anything you're the one fighting for a conclusive narrative. Draekke is saying we can't be sure if mafia knew lg or not because it's clear that he was a lost wolf type scenario and it could go either way. You're telling him to stop considering this and just consider it as scum, basically
 
Draekke said:
You're suggesting that there are two mafia in this game? Shizune has stated multiple times that each game starts with one mafia.
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I am suggesting that there are indies.
 
Like it can go either way so you should be considering it either way. There is absolutely no reason for LG to need to message his temmates or broadcast info he learns to teammates if he's in the same mafia chat. Is it explicitly stated they're together? No. But we can use a little common sense to see that they weren't. We're just not sure if they actually knew each other
 
Hidden said:
okay i know i said i was sheeping andrew's town read of you but wtf is this post? Draekke wasn't giving a conclusive narrative there? If anything you're the one fighting for a conclusive narrative. Draekke is saying we can't be sure if mafia knew lg or not because it's clear that he was a lost wolf type scenario and it could go either way. You're telling him to stop considering this and just consider it as scum, basically
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Tbh I didn't read his whole post, just the part that I quoted. In the very next sentence he should we leave open to either option :dw

I've just seen people say with high levels of confidence that they think LG and his team were unaware of each other and that smells fishy to me. LG might be a coaster, but he doesn't seem like the type of player to roll over and let his team mislynch like that. Would be blunder of the year. I just wanna say that we don't know for certain what the role and who knew what about it entailed.

Essentially, I have a FoS on pretty much anyone who is lying on either extreme of they did know/didn't know since the role was unclear and I think only scum would actually be influenced enough by their burden of information to allow their opinion on to be swayed to a side where they know they can frame the opposite end of the extreme.

If that makes sense, I can clarify further
 
Legend said:
[Vote Lynch Flower]

[Vote Execute MS]

Ive never played with flower, do they normally "lash out and self vote" instead of using logical defense when pressured?
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the issue with super emotional players that blow up as town. They have to replicate that as mafia, even if they are not as upset with being accused.
I think the outbursts this game were pretty forced.

tough to play with that type in general though, since you are forced to try and qualify their emotions.
 
Hidden said:
Like it can go either way so you should be considering it either way. There is absolutely no reason for LG to need to message his temmates or broadcast info he learns to teammates if he's in the same mafia chat. Is it explicitly stated they're together? No. But we can use a little common sense to see that they weren't. We're just not sure if they actually knew each other
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I think he was a kind of a lost wolf, we got lucky to consolidate the wagon on him
 
My problem with Draekke is his arguments/statements feel like hes either gaslighting ppl or strawmaning them

If he just plays like this every game then fine, but it just reads like hes trying to make players fall into fall into a "gatcha" built on a disingenuous argument.

I also dont like the reasoning for some of his reads. Like saying Hidden is town based on poking and proding. Must be in some other convo because it sure aint this one :mystery
 
Hidden said:
Like it can go either way so you should be considering it either way. There is absolutely no reason for LG to need to message his temmates or broadcast info he learns to teammates if he's in the same mafia chat. Is it explicitly stated they're together? No. But we can use a little common sense to see that they weren't. We're just not sure if they actually knew each other
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yer, this is what I'm saying. But further than that, only mafia knew for sure and I think it's suspect for members in the thread who want to conclusively paint that information in one way or another to either incriminate another person or give them a strong credit based on it is sus.
 
AndrewGreve said:
the issue with super emotional players that blow up as town. They have to replicate that as mafia, even if they are not as upset with being accused.
I think the outbursts this game were pretty forced.

tough to play with that type in general though, since you are forced to try and qualify their emotions.
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Thats a very good point, with DDL he was just accused and got annoyed at his reasoning for inactivity being questioned and just quit.

Flower just seemed to give up, be it due to their lie having no substance or apathy.

Im not familiar with everyone playing so I dunno, their baseline posting style.
 
JoJo said:
Tbh I didn't read his whole post, just the part that I quoted. In the very next sentence he should we leave open to either option :dw

I've just seen people say with high levels of confidence that they think LG and his team were unaware of each other and that smells fishy to me. LG might be a coaster, but he doesn't seem like the type of player to roll over and let his team mislynch like that. Would be blunder of the year. I just wanna say that we don't know for certain what the role and who knew what about it entailed.

Essentially, I have a FoS on pretty much anyone who is lying on either extreme of they did know/didn't know since the role was unclear and I think only scum would actually be influenced enough by their burden of information to allow their opinion on to be swayed to a side where they know they can frame the opposite end of the extreme.

If that makes sense, I can clarify further
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Tbh I am of the opinion that LG's team, at the very least, didn't know who he was. Just because honestly there wasn't really a push to save him. i mean yeah there were like, other options being floated and voted for and whatnot, but not like, a concerted effort or anything. And unless all the mafia roles are that strong he seemed like a pretty strong scum role lol.

That being said I am still evaluating if people did or not Im just leaning that way.

Sidebar aside, sure I get what you're saying, but it's just you went hard on draekke there for what was literally proven wrong in the next sentence lol
 
Laix said:
am i town? am i scum?

lynch me, and find out!

djoDYMT.gif
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Ballsy or over confident about something hmm
AndrewGreve said:
flower and Laix live and play in a completely world of mafia than I do.

or they are scum pretending they do.

really could be either or at this point.
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yeah, especially for laix I see this.
Laix said:
ummm okay its d2 even i've read the mechanics by now but i'll explain anyway because you seem lost!

any1 who voted for the lynch is a viable lynch candidate for day 2

i've made it vehemently clear i do not believe flower to be scum, but the 2 rocks swirling about your skull came to the conclusion i must be scum d1 for... im still not sure tbh?

the wagon on flower is set and she has admittedly given up. despite what i personally feel about her alignment, there is nothing i can do

voting for her is putting myself in the ring for the lynch next phase so i can prove a point

but, like i've said multiple times

if you think i'm scum jojo... do something about it

djoDYMT.gif
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more sass or come at me from laix, it feels subdued from what I remember about her, but then again I'm not sure if I remember which alignment was her super sassy side
 
Karma said:
My problem with Draekke is his arguments/statements feel like hes either gaslighting ppl or strawmaning them

If he just plays like this every game then fine, but it just reads like hes trying to make players fall into fall into a "gatcha" built on a disingenuous argument.

I also dont like the reasoning for some of his reads. Like saying Hidden is town based on poking and proding. Must be in some other convo because it sure aint this one :mystery
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nah you just aren't reading my posts is all tbh tbh
 
Mich said:
Who's the execution vote now?
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I thought that it was Atlantic storm with 6 votes but apparently it's Mystic.

@Shizune does Atlantic go by a different name? didn't see him in the vote talley.
 
Hidden said:
Tbh I am of the opinion that LG's team, at the very least, didn't know who he was. Just because honestly there wasn't really a push to save him. i mean yeah there were like, other options being floated and voted for and whatnot, but not like, a concerted effort or anything. And unless all the mafia roles are that strong he seemed like a pretty strong scum role lol.

That being said I am still evaluating if people did or not Im just leaning that way.
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Yeah, that's fair. I pretty much try and read most posts and the votes with two tones, the first being they knew and the second being that no one knew, etc. It's just pretty much how I'm adjudicating how someone might have played in the scenario and which one makes the most sense to me based on what I know and read from them.
Hidden said:
Sidebar aside, sure I get what you're saying, but it's just you went hard on draekke there for what was literally proven wrong in the next sentence lol
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lmfao yeah that's my bad

cba to read everyone cuz im eating and watching stuff but still trying to visit the thread with points i think that are significant:skully
 
AndrewGreve said:
has anyone given a reason for their excecute votes?

I know its going to be thin no matter what since it can only target low posters, but we dont actually need to consolidate this vote.
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Mine has literally just been based on completely inactivity for today. Mystic has posted the least (and I don't even think at all today?) so that's where my vote is.

In the future when there are actually maybe some relevant posts there I'll try to evaluate it further
 
Flower said:
Like I literally just told you why Lind's claim and points are BS and I keep getting ignored.
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because your tinfoil on what the role must be is a whatever theory of MAYBE

not enough to justify a lynch. Its also super lazy because your entire case if just rule mongering into a read. Basically the easiest thing to do as scum.

you still given nearly jack all for reads.

werent you going to post 600 times today and blow my mind or something?
 
Karma said:
Would u describe ur play so far like Draekke has?
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I'd need to see his exact description to tell you if I agreed fully or not, but I am definitely coming in and poking and prodding specifically things I'm thinking about as opposed to like, the entire thread or whatnot. I'm doing bursts of activity so I'm not wasting time going, "Hey literally everyone present tell me your top 3 scum reads" or something. I'm more curious in like, "X player explain / let's talk about Y" or more just what I feel like responding to at the time
 
Vanya said:
Most do

But to answer your question, i wanna solve Draeke and Andrew as soon as possible.

Andrew had weird shit early on with defending Draeke telling us when can ignore him and so on. Likewise he reminds me of a certain playstyle where a player acts like a beacon of stability trying to calm everyone down to make it seem like they are moving game forward. Maybe i am also forgetful but i for the life of me can't remember his actually actively pushing someone to be scum? Can you?

As for Draeke, his entrance to the game was downright bad, he used absurdly weak "reads" to make cases on people that lead nowhere, to me it seemed like someone who is desperate to fit in and establish himself as a townie in a non natural way. That's why i don't trust him, he just tries so fucking hard to be town
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you should ISO me if you havent seen a scum push.

I also focus on finding towns over finding scum. It is my preference and in general I think it is more effective at forcing mafia into the open.
 
Hidden said:
I think the thing here is like, most people know lind is 95% indie anyways, but I just think (myself included) don't really want to take the super safe obvious vote when imo she's probably neutral at worst.

Like, Lind is probably never mafia because of this weird 2 game with the mafia being seperated thing. Lind is probably never something MEGA anti town like a cult leader or something of that caliber because way too much attention gets thrown on lind immediately by being in both games. Also the fact that lind has joined every wagon so far also gives some amount of town cred. So idk I personally feel like she might just be a survivor or something at worst and I don't really feel like dealing with that atm
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linds post in a vacuum are enough to not consider a vote there today
 
JoJo said:
I hate this narrative. We can't conclusively say anything about it other than what was explicitly stated. In this very game, people mention a role madness is unpredictable - and yet others want to say they know for certain how the role works. That's incredibly suspicious behavior. If anything, it indicates to me that people are saying with confidence they knew he was a disconnected wolf and they're trying to divorce people from a useful day 1 vote.

I can't say for certain what it was and what it wasn't, but I know that no one else can other than the scum team themselves and that level of confidence and the discrediting is giving huge wolf vibes.

Seen it happen most of the day and it's something I'm going to be wary of when recombing through the thread.
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Ive kinda settled on about half the value of a normal d1 red flip

partnered with lg saying it wasnt based on anything LG did, its pretty mild cred to karma.

again have a town read that has waivered in strength on karma since d1, independent of the lynch
 
JoJo said:
for posterity

if she flips town what do you think the results will tell

and if she flips scum what do you think the results will tell?
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It further confirms that we got lucky on LG and it wasn't based on genius scum reads.

If she flip scum we flip tables and rejoice.

If she town, then we look at all those who forced people to vote for the wagon. As their credibility would be seriously hit.
 
Vanya said:
Trusts his town reads enoigh to not lynch me
Doesnt trust them enough to believr my TMI

You love to see it folks
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I guess this would make some sense from your pov as to why you would go after them post flower. So in your eyes, they are being selective? They don't confront you because of how defensive you have been, but will surely go after DDL? I think I'm understanding this a bit more.

[change vote lynch Flower] for LG's main character thing

The catching up is taking longer than I thought.
 
Owner Of A Lonely Heart said:
Ballsy or over confident about something hmm

yeah, especially for laix I see this.

more sass or come at me from laix, it feels subdued from what I remember about her, but then again I'm not sure if I remember which alignment was her super sassy side
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i am by no means a good mafia player but 9/10 when people think i’m scummy i’m actually a townie who just had a meltdown and wants to screw town over
 
JoJo said:
Tbh I didn't read his whole post, just the part that I quoted. In the very next sentence he should we leave open to either option :dw

I've just seen people say with high levels of confidence that they think LG and his team were unaware of each other and that smells fishy to me. LG might be a coaster, but he doesn't seem like the type of player to roll over and let his team mislynch like that. Would be blunder of the year. I just wanna say that we don't know for certain what the role and who knew what about it entailed.

Essentially, I have a FoS on pretty much anyone who is lying on either extreme of they did know/didn't know since the role was unclear and I think only scum would actually be influenced enough by their burden of information to allow their opinion on to be swayed to a side where they know they can frame the opposite end of the extreme.

If that makes sense, I can clarify further
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I think it is clear that LG did not share a chat with his team.
 
Karma said:
My problem with Draekke is his arguments/statements feel like hes either gaslighting ppl or strawmaning them

If he just plays like this every game then fine, but it just reads like hes trying to make players fall into fall into a "gatcha" built on a disingenuous argument.

I also dont like the reasoning for some of his reads. Like saying Hidden is town based on poking and proding. Must be in some other convo because it sure aint this one :mystery
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The fact I also had interactions with Draekke like these while we both were town reading each other, makes me think it is a personality trait and not a conscious plan to gaslight as scum(there would be good reason to not gaslight me I think)

I think draekke being frustrating to converse with is non-alightment indiciative.
 
Laix said:
i am by no means a good mafia player but 9/10 when people think i’m scummy i’m actually a townie who just had a meltdown and wants to screw town over
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:ryoma
 
AndrewGreve said:
Ive kinda settled on about half the value of a normal d1 red flip

partnered with lg saying it wasnt based on anything LG did, its pretty mild cred to karma.

again have a town read that has waivered in strength on karma since d1, independent of the lynch
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i actually did the same. i had a town lean on karma before it and i feel like he's playing the game. im not gonna say he definitely is town for it but im not gonna say he's definitely scum bussing his own mate

its just food for thought all around and i'd rather wait for more role reveals

Alwaysmind said:
It further confirms that we got lucky on LG and it wasn't based on genius scum reads.

If she flip scum we flip tables and rejoice.

If she town, then we look at all those who forced people to vote for the wagon. As their credibility would be seriously hit.
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why do we need further confirmation on the first? literally not a single person has said they've had a genius scum read on him and it was pretty much, by the lynchers, said to be either luck or a coincidence

if she flips scum, we do more than that. we look at the contents of the role and we cross reference people who sussed her last phase, defended her last phase while also look into people and where they voted. obviously the cross reference comes in comparison with this phase

if she's town then she played horrid imo and we look at the people who pressured her and look at their reasonings that go beyond fluff and being emotional
 
Flower said:
Draks, ffs vote Lind now. Andrew trusts you enough that you can derail this. And I'm dying next night anyway, but we can at least try to still get my ability off. Lind will evolve with this lynch and help us big time.
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If you have been reading the game, you would know that I am not super fond of a number of his reads. Just like when draekke didnt like my reads D1
 
Flower said:
Yeah, I enjoyed our team, too, but if Town can go against the rules like this, what should we do? Ofc it's annoying af.
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I'm like, convinced this is a slip and confirms that Vany is town in case there was any confusion on that. Because I'm assuming the "go against the rules" bit is talking about putting flower up even though she didn't vote the wagon lol
 
Laix said:
i am by no means a good mafia player but 9/10 when people think i’m scummy i’m actually a townie who just had a meltdown and wants to screw town over
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That sounds like a decent town play to me. If you are over the top townie, you won't live long enough to do stuff you want to do. I take self meta with a grain of salt. If it is true, that could potentially be a light town off of the screw town bit as I can sort of see that. This quote reminds me of 2 other players that I'm sort of familiar with.
 
Lind said:
In the games I've played with him, he's been a serial killer once. But mainly town.

And in the serial killer game he really didn't give many reads and he posted a lot of drawings.
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Okey i hope he gonna participate more cause i only saw his emotional posts and some fluff/drawings

Vanya said:
Can you honestly say she is town when her whole plan was from D1 to coast by her own words?
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This feels a bit like deja vu with the early "im gonna coast" claim lol, idk if i saw it from her in the bleach game or some other one

[Vote lynch Flower]

Vanya said:
As for Draeke, his entrance to the game was downright bad, he used absurdly weak "reads" to make cases on people that lead nowhere, to me it seemed like someone who is desperate to fit in and establish himself as a townie in a non natural way. That's why i don't trust him, he just tries so fucking hard to be town
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Eh if u had to compare his d1 and d2 performance, would u see a difference? Cause most stuff i saw from him was during this day and there seemed to be a lot of interactions going on, im assuming hes a newbie cause ive never seen him. Maybe someone can give meta info if theyve played with him
 
Shizune

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